Why Crabtree Should be the Pick
by KA1Z3R on Apr 12, 2009 8:09 AM PDT
24 comments
In a previous post of mine I detailed why I thought Orakpo should be our pick. I looked through some Crabtree videos and evaluations and found him to be a very good WR. Now I still don't want Crabtree to be our pick, but here's why Oakland should draft him (if orakpo isn't there)
-Size-
At 6-2, 208 pounds, Crabtree is one of the bigger receivers in the draft. That 208 pounds is pure muscle as he's one of the trimmest 208 pound people I've ever seen. However that tall, sleek frame spells I-N-J-U-R-Y to me. Or rather, it did. Closer inspection shows that while his legs and arms are fairly slim, they are rippling with muscles. Al loves his receivers tall and muscular (except for Cliff Branch) and that formula still works very well. Crabtree loves using that muscle to play physical football, especially against press corners. And if Al is debating between Crabtree and Maclin (don't know why he would though), that physicality factor could be the deciding factor.
-College Numbers-
For some reason I was sure Crabtree wouldn't be as good in his sophomore year as he was in his freshman year. I was proved wrong. In fact, that was the greatest miscalculation since people thinking the Earth was flat. Though his stats did go down, he was still the best WR in the NCAA.
In only two years, Crabtree racked up 231 receptions for 3,127 yards and 41 touchdowns. What's that tell you? Crabtree consistently makes the catch and gets lots of yards each time. Averaging 14.6 yards per catch in 07 and 12.0 yards 08, Crabs gets fairly long range passes and makes yards after the catches. Also worth noting he had 0 fumbles in two years. Nice ball-handling.
here's some highlight vids:
-#7 Possibilities-
I mentioned in my RAK post that Crabtree is who I think Cleveland will pick. However since I'm the draft guy for Cleveland, they might still go after Orakpo. If they do, and Crabtree wasn't picked up before Cleveland picked (seattle), then I'm sure Oakland will pick Crabtree. The only way I don't think they would is if the Eagles want to trade up for him. I know Davis doesn't trade down, like, ever. But two first round picks has got to make Al start to take some serious consideration into trading down (which I really hope he does). However, I still think Davis would draft Crabtree.
-What Crabtree Would Give the Raiders-
Crabtree has the best hands in the draft, no doubt about it, and Oakland needs a possession guy other than Miller. The Raiders have plenty of speed threats at WR, but nobody that can guarantee you they'll make the catch. Russell needs that one guy who he knows he can throw to who will make the catch and get some yards.
Crabtree also gives Oakland what posey calls "a true #1 receiver". Crabtree has goth great hands, and good speed. One of the faster receivers in the draft. However, he doesn't have the speed to outrun the faster corners and safeties in the league. He makes up for that, however, with his moves. If you watched those highlight vids or a Texas Tech game for that matter, you know Michael's one of the most elusive receivers in the draft, if not the most. Those moves help him break off the cover man and the defense when making the catch. He's one of the most prolific catch-and-run receivers I've ever seen. His physicality also comes into play here because he can also just stiff arm or bowl over the defender.
Many people have said that Crabtree does have one fault, and that's his route-running. This however doesn't seem like that big of a problem to me. Training camp and time around the facility would solve that. I'm more concerned with his injury that kept him from the combine and his pro-day. I don't know the specifics on the injury, but anything that requires major surgery and a month of recovery is never a good thing. I hope that if we draft him, it won't be too much of an inconvenience come mini-camp, OTA, training camp, etc.
Would I be happy if we drafted Crabtree? Yes I would. Would I rather we draft Orakpo? Definitely. Do I think that if both are gone we should draft Maclin? Dear God no.
Basically if Orakpo is gone and Crabtree is available, I say we either draft him or (preferably) trade down.
I may or may not make a post similar to this about Raji.
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Dont believe the hype!
First off he’s not 6’2, he’s too light to be pro football consistantly healthy,and he comes from a pass heavy talentless division in college! I think he’s all hype,like Dallas’s WR Williams when he came out of USC! Throw in his recent spat of injuries and i see a WR who’ll play maybe 4-5 games before hes a guarateed $40 mill injured reserve.Not to mention the speed hes going to lose try to bulk up for the nfl! I just dont think we should do it! O-line for ’09!
by LaRaider on Apr 12, 2009 8:24 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
O-Line???
What do you mean O-Line??? Our O-Line is already set with Mario Henderson and Khalif Barnes at the OT positions and at C we have Samson Satele now that we made that trade with the Dolphins. And playing OG for us we have Robert Gallery and Cooper Carlisle.
Michael Crabtree is a great WR and I think that he will be a Pro Bowler one day, and he will probably take the Raiders to the playoffs. Plus he once a Red Raider its time he became a Silver and Black Raider. Oh, and for the comment you made about him being “too light”, most WR’s in the NFL are around 6’2’’ and weigh 220 pounds. And if you look at what JLH did for the Raiders last season you can see that size is not what determines what you can do on the field.
by L.A. Raiders on Apr 12, 2009 10:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes O-Line
I know we have added people and we do have enough to have a functioning line. Is it improved? Most probably. Is It good? Probably not. Barnes is on a “compete” contract meaning that the staff doesn’t have full confidence in him and want him to show that he is good enough to stay. Henderson showed improvement from Harris but we need to see if he can continue. Satele from all I hear replaces Grove nicely but has a lot of trouble against strong NT’s.
We should still look at OT’s and C’s in this draft. The most glaring need is defense, but after that it’s between WR and O-line. The only reason people are saying only WR is because we used FA for O-line. Like I stated it still needs improvement.
Just HIT somebody.
by SBcitizen on Apr 12, 2009 11:01 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
my critiques on your O-Line comments
We all know the guards are set, just need some depth, no need for a draft pick here.
OT has four solid players. Henderson should and I think will be kept at LT, Barnes then goes to RT where he’s a huge upgrade over Green. Backups are Erik Pears who’s played both OT spots and been solid at both spots with right being his specialty. Green has been the right tackle starter for the past two years and been great in the running game. Though he more than lacks at pass blocking and commits several penalties. So I don’t see much need here.
C has two starter quality guys in Wade and Satele. You mention that Satele doesn’t handle big NT’s well, neither did Grove. However, Satele is younger, non-injury prone, and is still developing. Center looks good to me.
There are too many needs on the defense and at WR to draft for O-Line. We still need a DE, a DT, a LB, and a S. There’s four needs, throw in WR and we have as many needs as we do draft picks.
V- "I'm not questioning your powers of observation. I'm merely remarking on the paradox of asking a masked man who he is."
by KA1Z3R on Apr 12, 2009 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with you on Defense
The defense has problems and should be the first thing we address, and most of our picks should focus on this. I just wanted to remind people not to over look our needs on the O-line. We have so few draft picks that I think it will really be impossible to get most of what we need. We only have 5 picks and I think at least 3 should be used on Defense as the priority with one for WR and one for O-line.
Also, Barnes seems pretty dead set on starting at the LT. He basically said that Henderson would have to throw him out (there is a link in the DLD fanpost).
Just HIT somebody.
by SBcitizen on Apr 12, 2009 10:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
one pick should go O-Line, but there’s not enough picks.
Our needs are DT, DE, LB (either middle or outside), S, WR, and O-Line depth
V- "I'm not questioning your powers of observation. I'm merely remarking on the paradox of asking a masked man who he is."
by KA1Z3R on Apr 13, 2009 6:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is coming from a guy who can't spell Raiders he calls it "Raidres"
"We want to Win. The Raider fans deserve it. The Raider players deserve it,even my organization deserves it. You have to Win and Win with a vision of the Super Bowl. That's our passion here"- Mr. Davis
by nishal26 on Apr 12, 2009 11:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Amazing Post
Crabtree is a great talent. I love his hands. The best hands from the receivers in the draft. That is the only thing that separates his from the pack.
I like receivers who are naturally gifted like with speed, arm length, vertical and height. Ramses really fits this need well, but to be honest, Heywerd-Bey is also looking very satisfying. He is quite fast, but he has a great vertical and great size.
Police Fucking Hate Me, Trying To Relocate Me To LA, But Like The Raiders, I' ma Bring It Back To The Bay! - Nump
by Rayder K on Apr 12, 2009 10:42 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Crabtree has some talent but I don’t think that will transfer over into the NFL. Ramses and Heyward-Bey’s physical prowess will definitely help in the transition. I say we go defensive in the first and pick up a WR in the second.
Just HIT somebody.
by SBcitizen on Apr 12, 2009 10:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
I would like Orakpo or Raji to go defensive in the first and get Ramses Barden who I think is more talented then Crabtree he may not be able to catch like him but, he is 6’’6 i mean just imagne defending that.
"We want to Win. The Raider fans deserve it. The Raider players deserve it,even my organization deserves it. You have to Win and Win with a vision of the Super Bowl. That's our passion here"- Mr. Davis
by nishal26 on Apr 12, 2009 11:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
actually Ramses
is another “possession” guy in the draft. He’s big and physical with surprisingly good speed. i really want us to draft Barden.
There’s so many good WR in the draft that we can definitely afford to pass up on Crabtree, who I believe might be a bust. However, there aren’t many DE who can play both the run and pass well or DT’s with a combination of size and penetration ability. Grab Orakpo in the first and Barden in the second. Vaughn in the third and Taylor in the fourth. Our D would be much more improved and our WR would have that possession guy it’s so desperately needing.
V- "I'm not questioning your powers of observation. I'm merely remarking on the paradox of asking a masked man who he is."
by KA1Z3R on Apr 12, 2009 1:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Talent Wise
Crabtree is ahead. But, physically, Ramses is better.
Crabtree – Best hands, great routes, okay size.
Barden – Good hands, good routes, amazing size.
Size = Height, vertical, and arm length mixed together.
Police Fucking Hate Me, Trying To Relocate Me To LA, But Like The Raiders, I' ma Bring It Back To The Bay! - Nump
by Rayder K on Apr 12, 2009 9:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup...
Darrius Heyward-Bey is looking good out there, but the only thing that seperates Michael Crabtree from Darrius Heyward-Bey is his passion for the game. I really like what DHB brings to the table, but I have never seen him have a real passion for the game or to become better every year. When I see Micheal Crabtree in his games and in his interviews I see how much passion he has for the game and to improve which is what I like the most about him.
by L.A. Raiders on Apr 12, 2009 10:53 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
DHB
wouldn’t even be in the 1st or 2nd round if it wasn’t for the fastest time at the combine just because he’s fast doesn’t mean he can catch
He didn’t have much production in college, BUT does have a good upside in 3yrs or so.
WE NEED TO FIX THE RUN D FIRST
and we have speed WR need a possession WR (Ramses Barden) 3rd and DT/DE in the first 2 rounds or DE/DT
by S-n-B4life on Apr 12, 2009 12:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
just because he's fast
doesn’t mean he can’t catch. He’s got some of the best hands for a speedy guy in the draft. And his college numbers are marred by the fact that Maryland was outrageously run heavy, didn’t have a great QB, and didn’t have any receiving weapons other than DHB so he was constantly double teamed. Even through the double teams he was still one of the best NCAA receivers this year and was so against some of the best non-SEC defenses in the NCAA in VT, BC, and FSU. He’s most certainly first round talent.
I do agree though that the run D is top priority. However, it should be DE in the first and WR in the second. Barden is not a third round guy. As it stands he’s a high second. There aren’t many balance DE’s in the draft and not many good speed/catch combos at WR in the draft.
Balance DE’s:
Orakpo
maybe Brown
Gilbert
Barwin
Speed/catch WR’s:
Crabtree
Nicks
Barden
Robiskie
Kelly
V- "I'm not questioning your powers of observation. I'm merely remarking on the paradox of asking a masked man who he is."
by KA1Z3R on Apr 12, 2009 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
DHB
08 Stats 42 catches 609 yards 5 TDs
07 Stats 51 for 785 and 3 TDs
06 stats 45 for 694 and 5 TDs
So he is better than I thought ,but still not worth the 7th pick unless anyone thinks Javon Walker will pan out and we have time to get DHB up to the NFL level.
But ,that won’t help the run.
Orakapo is the only Pass rushing DE worth the 7TH and I’m not sold on his run stopping ability, but if he’s there (which I doubt) and get a Possession WR in the 2nd (Barden) then run stuffing DT in the 3rd (Kelly can still get penetration) hopefully Brinkley in the 4th and move Morrison to Strongside LB That scenerio would be OK.
The problem is we do not have enough picks to fix our needs without trading down.
In my opinion DT / DE, MLB and SS are top Priorities WR only fits in with the best available versus need.
Although I like Morrison I think he’s better at OLB and the need for a good MLB or SS in our Division w/ Gates and Gonzales is a Must
by S-n-B4life on Apr 12, 2009 3:05 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Basically it comes down to this
Is it the WR fault we had the 32 ranked passing?
or the lack of an O-line Causing JR to rush his throws and be inaccurate, or poor route running and unable to get open. To many variables.
The O-line is arguably better. So the Passing should be, if JR is the QB we hope he is. And with another year under JR’s belt and the same with Chaz and JLH the passing should be better without a WR being drafted this high. Look at Detroit for example how many No.1 WR have they drafted over the years.
Awesome college WR don’t have a great NFL record.
Point being IF Crabtree isn’t there( I hope he isn’t) don’t just pick a WR if He’s not really a need. Even if he’s there TRADE the pick or Draft a DT (sorry but I don’t think Orakapo will be there at 7)
Defense is more of a Need.
There aren’t a lot of variables as to why the RUN D sucked.
D-line that’s about it.
A good D-line will make the LB’s and secondary that much better.
It’s not always about getting the BEST player.
It’s about getting the best player of need for our system . To make the Team better.
by S-n-B4life on Apr 12, 2009 4:03 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
NA not arakpo
RAJI baby i like youre thinking though D but up front is where we need help most of the rushing yards that came on us was where up the gut and not enough penatration ya AGIAN RAJI!!!!!!!!!
by rader4life on Apr 12, 2009 6:56 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You Know What
I also think Javon Walker will be good this year. Some sort of weird feeling. I feel he is in the correct mindset now and he is ready to take to the field.
Police Fucking Hate Me, Trying To Relocate Me To LA, But Like The Raiders, I' ma Bring It Back To The Bay! - Nump
by Rayder K on Apr 12, 2009 9:39 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I Totally forgot about him
he only had one touchdown (Jets game) and a couple of drops.
"We want to Win. The Raider fans deserve it. The Raider players deserve it,even my organization deserves it. You have to Win and Win with a vision of the Super Bowl. That's our passion here"- Mr. Davis
by nishal26 on Apr 12, 2009 10:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
good as in
possible starter? How good do you have him as?
I too have a feeling that Walker will be good, but good for the role he’s given, which to me is an occasional #3 or #4 WR. I can’t see him cracking the starting lineup with Higgins, Schilens, and a WR soon to be. Not to mention Shields might be healthy and there’s still Watkins and Holland.
I am concerned this year about Schilens and Higgins though. I’m interested to see if they can keep playing at this level or if they were just one-year wonders. I think Higgins will be fine, but Schilens has me worried.
V- "I'm not questioning your powers of observation. I'm merely remarking on the paradox of asking a masked man who he is."
by KA1Z3R on Apr 13, 2009 6:36 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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