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Kiper isn't the Guru he thinks he is

Mel Kiper's NFL draft hits and misses

Is it just me or are there more MISSES than HITS? So take what he says with a grain of salt.

I hope we can add Mitchell and DHB to his misses.

A small sampling of some hits and misses for Mel Kiper Jr., who began analyzing college football players and NFL drafts in the 1970s and made his ESPN draft-day debut in 1984:

Hits:

Kiper rated Purdue QB Jeff George as the 84th-best player in the 1990 draft; George was chosen No. 1 overall by Indianapolis; he went 46-78 as a starter plus a 1-2 playoff record, in 12 seasons with five NFL teams. As on-screen graphics were being prepared for 1990 draft show, someone at ESPN asked Kiper why George wasn't on the list of top prospects. "He said, 'Well, I can't put up a Top 40 list and not have the No. 1 guy.' I said, 'Well, put him 40th. If you have to put him somewhere, put him 40th,'" Kiper remembers.

Kiper rated Notre Dame QB Rick Mirer as the 30th-best player in the 1993 draft; Mirer was chosen No. 2 overall by Seattle; he went 24-44 as a starter, with 50 TDs and 76 INTs, in eight seasons with five NFL teams.

Asked to cite a player he was more impressed by than NFL teams were, Kiper points to Towson State running back and kick returner Dave Meggett, who lasted until the fifth round in 1989 before being drafted by the New York Giants. Meggett wound up as a two-time Pro Bowl selection and ranks 37th in league history in all-purpose yards.

Misses:

Kiper rated TCU's LaDainian Tomlinson as tied for the 25th-best player in the 2001 draft, and only the third-best running back that year, behind Mississippi's Deuce McAllister and Wisconsin's Michael Bennett. Tomlinson was chosen fifth overall by San Diego; he ranks second in NFL history with 126 TDs rushing and 14th with more than 11,000 yards rushing. McAllister has run for 49 TDs and 6,096 yards; Bennett has run for 13 TDs and 3,627 yards.

Kiper had QBs Dan McGwire and Brett Favre rated evenly heading into the 1991 draft; San Diego State's McGwire (brother of baseball's Mark) was chosen No. 16 overall by Seattle; Southern Mississippi's Favre was taken in the second round, No. 33 overall, by Atlanta. McGwire made five NFL starts, the last in 1995; Favre was traded to Green Bay before the 1992 season and retired in February with one Super Bowl championship and league records for career TD passes (464), completions (5,720), yards passing (65,127) and regular-season victories (169).

Kiper is the first to acknowledge he has a history of misses in both directions on high picks by the Detroit Lions, who have the No. 1 overall choice Saturday.

He thought Houston QB Andre Ware "was going to be a great NFL quarterback. Didn't turn out that way." Ware was chosen No. 7 overall by Detroit in 1990; he retired after six career NFL starts. Kiper considered Ohio State LB Chris Spielman "a decent-to-good player. I thought he was a fourth- or fifth-round pick." Spielman was taken 29th overall by Detroit; he was a four-time Pro Bowl selection. "Had a great NFL career," Kiper says. "Chris always tells the story: When he woke up at 3 in the morning, he'd look at a picture of me he put on the wall and would do 300 sit-ups, 300 push-ups. It motivated him to say, 'This moron, this idiot, said I couldn't get it done.'"

More recently, Kiper was high on Southern Cal WR Mike Williams; Detroit took him 10th overall in 2005, Williams made seven starts, had 44 catches and two TDs, and was out of the league after three seasons.

"Mike let his weight get up there. Another Detroit Lion. When the Detroit Lions take a player," Kiper says with a self-effacing smile, "I'm not going to hit that player too good."

 

 

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Kiper is an arrogant ass...

but give him a break. I’d say 10 misses in 25 years is pretty damn good. I’d take those odds any day. Al Davis has had over 20 misses in 4 drafts from years 2003 to 2006 and I can name every single player.

by kawelu on Apr 28, 2009 11:10 PM PDT reply actions  

+1

fuck kiper and todd mcdouche.

they act like they know EVERYTHING.

Stang PRIDE!!!!!!!!!

by Robby1987 on Apr 28, 2009 11:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

Tell me something Rob...

If kiper and mcshay said that DHB and Mitchell were solid picks for the raiders this year, would you still be bashing them? I highly doubt it! I don’t like them either and they may not know everything but I think it’s safe to say that they know somethings about football.

by kawelu on Apr 29, 2009 12:54 AM PDT reply actions  

in my opinion

mcshays better than kiper is now.

either way they both assholes for completly ripping the raiders.

Stang PRIDE!!!!!!!!!

by Robby1987 on Apr 29, 2009 4:51 AM PDT up reply actions  

but wat is something?

anyone can make a guess based on stats in front of them. i (and i hope many others) would still feel skeptical of mel kiper even if he said the raiders picks were solid.

Don't confuse me with the facts, my mind is made up!!

by naq92 on Apr 29, 2009 9:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

Something is information...

You can ask kiper almost anything about a player and 9 times out of 10, he’s going to know the answer whether it be stats, injuries,back round,etc. He had been rating players and drafts for 25 years for the league. If he was such an idiot and didn’t know what he was doing, I’m sure the NFL would have replaced him by now. Even if kiper picked 25 busts in 25 years, that’s one bust a year.

Al Davis had 8 busts each in the 2003 (J.Grove, S.Schweigert, C.Francis, J.Morant, S.Johnson, C.Spencer, C.Anderson. and A.Sommersell) and 2004(T.Brayton, T.Johnson, S.Williams, S.Pierson, D.Gabriel, D.Rykert, S.Shabazz and R.Hoag) drafts alone. When I say busts, I mean either not playing for us anymore or not even playing in the league at all after we picked them. Look, I personally don’t like the guy because he irritates me but don’t say he doesn’t know anything about football. I know that the raider nation is piss with him because he was honest and said that we reached on all our draft picks but it’s true whether it works out for us or not!

by kawelu on Apr 29, 2009 10:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

Brayton is in the league

had 4.5 sacks for Carolina last year. Had promise but we cut him and signed Kelly.

"..what you mean? I'm a legend like Kareem!"

by CommittedToExcellence on Apr 30, 2009 1:55 AM PDT up reply actions  

ya and although jake grove was shaky at times

the contract he received this offseason suggests that he wasn’t a bust.

i’m definitely not saying kiper doesn’t know football. I am saying that just because he thinks mike mitchell isn’t a very good football player at all, doesn’t mean he, by default, won’t be. You can never tell how a draft class will turn out the week after they’re drafted. and mel kiper acts like he CAN tell. Which is just incredibly arrogant and ignorant..

Don't confuse me with the facts, my mind is made up!!

by naq92 on Apr 30, 2009 9:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'm not saying kiper is never wrong...

All I’m saying is he does have some football knowledge as everyone on here is saying he doesn’t know what he’s talking about because he didn’t agree with our picks. He’s has a pretty good success rate compared to al’s who’s given the raider nation nightmares in the past 10 drafts. The problem is al is always reaching and going against the grain instead of just going with the best player that we need for our team.

by kawelu on May 1, 2009 1:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

Forget about Kiper...

Heybey and Mitchell now gotta prove, they where worth the picks. And I think they will…

Just win, baby!

by trentemoeller on Apr 29, 2009 3:18 AM PDT reply actions  

lol

and mike williams..i think his exact quote was somthing like this

“ill see you at his hall of fame ceremony”

Stang PRIDE!!!!!!!!!

by Robby1987 on Apr 29, 2009 4:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

I really think this whole draft 'industry; is starting to get a little full of itself

especially when they think they know more than the teams and just because these TV guys dont know much about someone its a bad pick – GET OVER YOURSELVES YOU PRETENTIOUS ASSHOLES.
And when you hear them say about one team “well they reached a little but they got the guys they wanted and i respect that” and then they trash the raiders for reaching on DHB well DHB is the guy Cable and Al wanted so FUCK WHAT YOU THINK (maybe that should be the new slogan for the 50th anniversary)
I think Mitchell says it best in the quote in my sig below

"Mel Kiper has his opinion and I respect it. But what does it mean? My 9-year-old nephew can watch film and make an opinion. I think I value the opinion of scouts who get paid to make their opinions. It will carry me through my career. It will serve as motivation for me." - Mike Mitchell

by Ozraider on Apr 29, 2009 5:15 AM PDT reply actions  

+1

i think i may have to start to watch the draft on mute from now on!!

Don't confuse me with the facts, my mind is made up!!

by naq92 on Apr 29, 2009 9:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

He's missed a lot more than

is mentioned in this piece but that is my point, this IS an inexact system, and if he would acknowledge that I would have no problem. This idea that drafting one player is a reach, and another a good pick at that position based upon an artificial list is just inane. Nobody, and I mean nobody has any idea which players will excel and which will flop. Last year at this time I had a man crush on Maualuga, this year I watched him and wondered where he was on the field. Which Maualuga will be there for Cincy? I don’t know and neither does anyone else.

by Laoren on Apr 29, 2009 7:05 AM PDT reply actions  

I think all this proves...

is that detroit and seattle need to stop listening to kiper.

by gl12ox05 on Apr 29, 2009 11:00 AM PDT reply actions  

To Kiper

If you were as good as you think u are you would be working for an NFL team and building a Championship team with all of your so called Knowledge of the rookies but, your not so after a year or 2 go by and people forget your stupidity. The real talent evaluators don’t ask your opinion because they all know you’re a joke. Its just talk, the media for which you work for named you a draft guru.
Put your money were your mouth is, try and find a NFL team to hire you and run there draft take them to a championship on your drafting expertise Then talk your talk until you walk the walk SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!

Just venting

by S-n-B4life on Apr 29, 2009 12:07 PM PDT reply actions  

I have trashed Kuiper, Mcshay and Mayock

as much if not more than anyone since the draft but I will admit that I enjoy listening to them discuss prospects in the lead up to the draft I find it entertaining.
What a lot of people lose sight of is that they are TV personalities NOT real NFL scouts. They mainly go by information that teams tell them (which is mostly smoke and mirrors) do you honestly think that if teams really like a guy and are hoping he falls to them they are gonna tell todd or Mel – NO FUCKEN WAY because within 15 seconds they are on TV telling the rest of the league that this unknown guy that (insert team) really really likes is shooting up draft boards drawing attention and diminishing the chances he will fall.

It also pisses me off that the majority of people just go “well Mel and Todd said its a bad pick so that means they a certain to be a bust” THEY HAVENT EVEN PLAYED A FUCKEN NFL GAME YET!!!

the good thing is from what I have learnt about DHB and Iron Mike this criticism will only make them hungrier so in a way – THANKS MEL AND TODD for motivating our guys to a higher level

also venting

"Mel Kiper has his opinion and I respect it. But what does it mean? My 9-year-old nephew can watch film and make an opinion. I think I value the opinion of scouts who get paid to make their opinions. It will carry me through my career. It will serve as motivation for me." - Mike Mitchell

by Ozraider on Apr 30, 2009 3:56 AM PDT reply actions  

kiper##########

who made kiper king of the draft anyway??????? i can do better than him!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

by sports with steve on Apr 30, 2009 10:30 AM PDT reply actions  

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