X Raider Moss Retires , Is he Hall Of Fame Worthy Though ?

by aa420 on Aug 2, 2011 3:25 AM PDT

After wearing his welcome out around the league Randy Mossdecided to hang them up on Monday . The NFL network has anointed him a future hall of famer , and im not sure I agree .

Yes he very well may be the most physically gifted receiver to play the game , and yes he put up some numbers , but is that all there is to a hall of fame player , is greatness no longer required to enter the hall ? Moss never fully developed into the receiver he could of been . He got by on sheer athletic ability and never really worked at becoming a precise route runner or a solid team mate. As his athletic ability faded he never developed the tools that allow veteran receivers like Jerry Rice to continue to play even as their speed begins to fade .

With our own Tim Brownstill waiting, along with several other wideouts with Superbowl rings , solid numbers , etc, is Moss truly deserving . He refused to run the whole route tree , and was a cancer in the locker room . He was an undiciplined route runner who was never where he was supposed to be . Even in his prime he had success because Culpepper could run around for 8 to 14 seconds to buy time to find him .

I think there is more to a hall of famer than stats , leadership , character , and professionalism should come into play . Both Moss and T.O. are star receivers , but are they hall of fame receivers ? If a player is a disruptive malcontent , creates problems in the locker room , hinder and undermine their coaches efforts , and just straight up quit on the Field for all the world to see as Moss did in Oakland , do numbers make you a hall of famer ?

Poll

Is Moss hall of fame worthy

yes

16 votes

hells no

18 votes

34 votes | Poll has closed

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Comments

I hate Moss and wish him a death that involves being kicked into a fiery pit.

But he’s a HOFer. Not first ballot – no WR is deserving of that except Jerry Rice – but he’ll get in eventually. He was possibly the greatest deep threat and truest gamebreaker the league has ever seen.

I’ll be telling my kids what a cunt he was in Oakland, but I’ll also be telling them about watching him in Minny and NE and just being awestruck by his ability. My closest friend became a Vikings fan in our youth because of Moss.

"In football, I root for the Oakland Raiders because they hire castoffs, outlaws, malcontents, and fuck -ups, they have lots of penalties, fights, and paybacks, and because Al Davis told the rest of the pig NFL owners to go get fucked. Someday, the Raiders will be strong again, and they will dip the ball in shit and shove it down the throats of the wholesome, white, heartland teams that pray together and don't deliver late hits." - George Carlin.

by Screwfish on Aug 2, 2011 3:39 AM PDT reply actions

yes , but do hall of fame receivers get traded in their prime for low round picks , do they get traded three times in one year , should you be able to never develop your route running , disrupt teams , or refuse to go over the middle and be a hall of fame

player

by aa420 on Aug 2, 2011 4:33 AM PDT up reply actions

i mean fitzgerald had a rough ride last year , didnt have a QB , etc ... but you didnt see him sit on his helmet like a fit throwing 5 yr old and shut it down , he was a professional

Michel Irving barely got in after his off feild baggage , but he kept his baggage out of the locker room , how can you shut it down time after time turn your locker room into a zoo , and be a guy noone wants in their locker room and be HOF

by aa420 on Aug 2, 2011 4:38 AM PDT reply actions

i dont think he is

he didnt always play his hardest, you dont put a guy in the Hall of Fame when he played when he wanted to.

by RyanTheRaider on Aug 2, 2011 7:05 AM PDT reply actions

He is 100% first time ballot

Even though he didn’t work hard for the Raiders he is still one of the best receivers of all time.

by Trho14 on Aug 2, 2011 7:43 AM PDT reply actions

You dont keep the guy that is 2nd all time in receiving TDs out of the hall. I hate him but he is a HOFer.

Make him wait a few years because of the extra curriculars but he is a HOFer. The stats get him in. I hate him more than just about anybody to ever play the game but he deserves to be in based off the stats.

"We want to win. The Raider fans deserve it. The Raider players deserve it, even my organization deserves it. You have to win and you have to win with a vision for the Super Bowl. That's our passion here."--Al Davis

"Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is."--Vince Lombardi

by Marcus Allen Krause on Aug 2, 2011 8:47 AM PDT reply actions

Defininetly not a first ballot

If class act guys like Tim Brown, who has stats too, can’t get in the first time than he doesn’t deserve it either. He put up numbers, big numbers in New England, and that should eventually get him in. But no rings, a pretty bad strech to end his career, and his piss poor attitude don’t deserve first time ballot consideration. Hell, Chris Carter isn’t in yet. Irvin and Rice got in because of merit and hard work. Irvin lived it up, but backed up his game with Championships. I don’t like Moss, but I won’t deny he’s had a good career. He’s just a waste of a talented player. It’s a shame.

by lakers007raiders on Aug 2, 2011 9:04 AM PDT reply actions

Exactly, he should look back and be embarrassed at his actions and definitely should not be a first ballot guy.

As far as I am concerned make him wait until his very last year of eligibility. No way should he be a first ballot guy, he should be a last ballot guy. However, he deserves to be in.

"Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is."--Vince Lombardi

by Marcus Allen Krause on Aug 2, 2011 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions

He's first ballot

2nd all time receiving TD and single biggest long ball threat in the history of NFL (at least one 60 yrds TD catch 11 out of his first 12 yrs in the NFL). That ‘98 Viking team was the most potent offence up to that time. What we all dislike is the “new” traits of WR (I’m thinking Keyshawn Johnson started it and is to blame) – oversize ego; me big, team small; blame the coach, QB, ref, etc for any shortcomings, louder than the rest of the offence combined. Thrash talk is acceptable and when creative, entertainment but this new breed is way over the top – TO, Ocho, Moss, completely unprofessional. However, Moss backed it up, hence, I’ll give it to him.

by raiders4liffe on Aug 2, 2011 10:33 AM PDT reply actions

no way is he a first ballot hall of famer if Chris Carter and Tim Brown werent.

i would put him behind those 2 in the best WR ever conversation every single time and neither of them got in first ballot.

"Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is."--Vince Lombardi

by Marcus Allen Krause on Aug 2, 2011 10:56 AM PDT up reply actions

T Brown and Carter,

are also well deserving. Only problem is the class of WR over the last 2 years that just came up with J Rice, etc. However, as much as I admire T Brown for everything that he stands, I can’t diminish Moss’ accomplishments simply because of his persona.

by raiders4liffe on Aug 3, 2011 5:43 AM PDT up reply actions

This shouldn't even be a discussion

if you don’t think Randy Moss should be in the Hall of Fame, you clearly know very little about football.

by Kyle_B on Aug 2, 2011 11:04 AM PDT reply actions

So why isn't Cliff branch in?...The mystery of the HOF selections are a joke now.

Moss, by sheer force, longevity and numbers is worthy, but not before a lot of other WR’s; most notably Branch & Brown.

The cowards never started, the weak died along the way....

by BlackHeartSilverEyes on Aug 2, 2011 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions

Apples and oranges

I’m a Raider fan for life and I love Cliff Branch, but he was no Randy Moss. Branch had 2 seasons with 1000+ receiving yards, Moss had 10. 67 TD’s for Branch, 153 for Moss. About 8,700 career receiving yards for Branch, just under 15,000 for Moss. When you look at the numbers, Moss is one of the best WRs of all time. 5th all time in receiving yards, 2nd all time in receiving TDs, 8th in receptions, etc. If anything don’t argue Branch, argue for Tim Brown. He is another no brainer HOFer.

In the end, I think people let their personal feelings get in the way in this argument. Hell, I’m still bitter about his time in Oakland and I wish he would have given a shit. But players don’t get into the Hall of Fame for being nice team guys, they get in because they put up historic numbers, which Randy Moss did.

by Kyle_B on Aug 2, 2011 12:48 PM PDT up reply actions

Numbers aren't the end-all and be-all

Mainly because they can be quite deceiving. Yes, Moss has numbers all over Branch, but look at the difference in offenses, defenses, and game rules. It is indeed comparing apples and oranges, but you are saying that the numbers for a player from a league specifically oriented to put up pinball numbers should be the same as a player from an era when defense was emphasized, and passing was not. QB’s have the same issue; a journeyman can put up Bradshaw numbers today, but that doesn’t make him Hall material.

I am not a Moss fan, because he is/was the type of player I have always despised: a coaster, a guy too lazy to develop tremendous talent because he is able to get by on physical attributes. Imagine Moss with a work ethic similar to Jerry RIce… that would be one of the greatest players ever, instead of an explosive playmaker that wore out his welcome within a few years, everywhere he went.

Hall of Fame, but he coulda been even more…

Failure builds character; success reveals it

by signcut on Aug 2, 2011 6:43 PM PDT up reply actions

Moss with Jerry Rice's work ethic

would have been the greatest athlete of any sport anywhere.

Unfortunately, the most talented at anything also tend to learn pretty quickly that they can coast on talent alone and don’t live up to it.

by Screwfish on Aug 2, 2011 10:04 PM PDT up reply actions

Very good points.

I do think Moss is a better player than Branch, but probably not to the extent that I had originally thought. Thanks for responding.

Also, can we agree on the fact that Moss is a no brainer for the HOF?

by Kyle_B on Aug 2, 2011 10:53 PM PDT up reply actions

I'd say that Moss is a HoF player

I just don’t have to like it… :)

For those too young to remember, though, Lance Alworth is one of the greatest WR’s ever, and too many have either forgotten or never knew about him. Playing in the 60’s, with rules favoring the defense and wide-open offense pretty much unheard of, for most of his career Alworth averaged over 100 YPG, over 1000 YPS, over 23 YPC, and more than 10 TD’s a year. Those would be numbers that would be excellent in the league TODAY, and they are over 40 years old…

Failure builds character; success reveals it

by signcut on Aug 3, 2011 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions

No argument over Moss' stats...or induction.

And these other men have pretty much filled in my blanks with exception that Branch was also probably the shortest WR during his time and the game wasnt so pass crazy then. Stabler & Plunkett didnt throw 45 times a game ( I saw Branch play in Oakland a lot in the 70’s and in LA as well). Branch’s hustle and out and out speed made him seem like he was 6’5".
Don’t forget that douche, Lynn Swann, went into the hall with 53 TD, 336 Rec and 3 pro bowls. So seriously….where is Cliff?

The cowards never started, the weak died along the way....

by BlackHeartSilverEyes on Aug 3, 2011 6:50 PM PDT up reply actions

The same place that Plunkett is, or Stabler...

For whatever reason, there are a number of Raiders that could/should be in the Hall of Fame that aren’t, and those three are excellent examples. Maybe they weren’t exciting enough, or personable enough, or maybe it’s because of Al being the owner, I don’t know… but I do know that it is BS.

Unfortunately, it looks like it will stay that way for a while, maybe always…

Failure builds character; success reveals it

by signcut on Aug 5, 2011 11:17 AM PDT up reply actions